Question about large confeerence
Hi, I'm trying to set up a large audio conference of over 1000 users where only 1 or 2 users are talking and the rest are just listening, but after 600-700 users the CPU usage gets too high and the audio gets choppy, I understand that mod_conference is not optimized for my use case but was wondering if someone has any suggestions on what can be done to optimize for my use case. I was also thinking that maybe there is a better alternative for what I look for, such as having just the talkers on the conference and the listeners should listen to it via mod_local_stream or maybe use something like eavesdrop for the listeners but not sure if and how much performance I would gain. Thanks for any help or input
definitely conference with two participant, and 598 on localstream -giovanni On Thu, Apr 19, 2018, 18:38 Abaci B <abaci64@gmail.com> wrote:
Hi, I'm trying to set up a large audio conference of over 1000 users where only 1 or 2 users are talking and the rest are just listening, but after 600-700 users the CPU usage gets too high and the audio gets choppy, I understand that mod_conference is not optimized for my use case but was wondering if someone has any suggestions on what can be done to optimize for my use case. I was also thinking that maybe there is a better alternative for what I look for, such as having just the talkers on the conference and the listeners should listen to it via mod_local_stream or maybe use something like eavesdrop for the listeners but not sure if and how much performance I would gain. Thanks for any help or input
_________________________________________________________________________ Professional FreeSWITCH Consulting Services: consulting@freeswitch.org http://www.freeswitchsolutions.com
Official FreeSWITCH Sites http://www.freeswitch.org http://confluence.freeswitch.org http://www.cluecon.com
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Thanks for the reply. Another idea I'm thinking of is to add a LISTEN_ONLY mflag to mod_conference and only run conference_loop_input thread on channels that don't have this flag, that way I don't need to set up a shoutcast server and have everything contained within freeswitch, does that make sense? On Thu, Apr 19, 2018 at 3:20 PM, Giovanni Maruzzelli <gmaruzz@gmail.com> wrote:
definitely conference with two participant, and 598 on localstream
-giovanni
On Thu, Apr 19, 2018, 18:38 Abaci B <abaci64@gmail.com> wrote:
Hi, I'm trying to set up a large audio conference of over 1000 users where only 1 or 2 users are talking and the rest are just listening, but after 600-700 users the CPU usage gets too high and the audio gets choppy, I understand that mod_conference is not optimized for my use case but was wondering if someone has any suggestions on what can be done to optimize for my use case. I was also thinking that maybe there is a better alternative for what I look for, such as having just the talkers on the conference and the listeners should listen to it via mod_local_stream or maybe use something like eavesdrop for the listeners but not sure if and how much performance I would gain. Thanks for any help or input
_________________________________________________________________________ Professional FreeSWITCH Consulting Services: consulting@freeswitch.org http://www.freeswitchsolutions.com
Official FreeSWITCH Sites http://www.freeswitch.org http://confluence.freeswitch.org http://www.cluecon.com
FreeSWITCH-users mailing list FreeSWITCH-users@lists.freeswitch.org http://lists.freeswitch.org/mailman/listinfo/freeswitch-users UNSUBSCRIBE:http://lists.freeswitch.org/mailman/options/freeswitch-users http://www.freeswitch.org
_________________________________________________________________________ Professional FreeSWITCH Consulting Services: consulting@freeswitch.org http://www.freeswitchsolutions.com
Official FreeSWITCH Sites http://www.freeswitch.org http://confluence.freeswitch.org http://www.cluecon.com
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There's already a muted flag you could use for that. On 19 April 2018 at 20:55, Abaci B <abaci64@gmail.com> wrote:
Thanks for the reply. Another idea I'm thinking of is to add a LISTEN_ONLY mflag to mod_conference and only run conference_loop_input thread on channels that don't have this flag, that way I don't need to set up a shoutcast server and have everything contained within freeswitch, does that make sense?
On Thu, Apr 19, 2018 at 3:20 PM, Giovanni Maruzzelli <gmaruzz@gmail.com> wrote:
definitely conference with two participant, and 598 on localstream
-giovanni
On Thu, Apr 19, 2018, 18:38 Abaci B <abaci64@gmail.com> wrote:
Hi, I'm trying to set up a large audio conference of over 1000 users where only 1 or 2 users are talking and the rest are just listening, but after 600-700 users the CPU usage gets too high and the audio gets choppy, I understand that mod_conference is not optimized for my use case but was wondering if someone has any suggestions on what can be done to optimize for my use case. I was also thinking that maybe there is a better alternative for what I look for, such as having just the talkers on the conference and the listeners should listen to it via mod_local_stream or maybe use something like eavesdrop for the listeners but not sure if and how much performance I would gain. Thanks for any help or input
____________________________________________________________ _____________ Professional FreeSWITCH Consulting Services: consulting@freeswitch.org http://www.freeswitchsolutions.com
Official FreeSWITCH Sites http://www.freeswitch.org http://confluence.freeswitch.org http://www.cluecon.com
FreeSWITCH-users mailing list FreeSWITCH-users@lists.freeswitch.org http://lists.freeswitch.org/mailman/listinfo/freeswitch-users UNSUBSCRIBE:http://lists.freeswitch.org/mailman/options/freeswitch-users http://www.freeswitch.org
_________________________________________________________________________ Professional FreeSWITCH Consulting Services: consulting@freeswitch.org http://www.freeswitchsolutions.com
Official FreeSWITCH Sites http://www.freeswitch.org http://confluence.freeswitch.org http://www.cluecon.com
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_________________________________________________________________________ Professional FreeSWITCH Consulting Services: consulting@freeswitch.org http://www.freeswitchsolutions.com
Official FreeSWITCH Sites http://www.freeswitch.org http://confluence.freeswitch.org http://www.cluecon.com
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I was thinking that the muted flag (CAN_SPEAK?) is something that can change mid conference which means there is a chance of loosing a single frame (the last one right before muting). I was more interested in knowing as far as performance if it makes sense. not sure if this is safe but something like only starting conference_loop_launch_input if that flag is not set. I still wish there would be module that would do exactly this (something like shoutcast but local and without the shoutcast latency) On Thu, Apr 19, 2018 at 5:19 PM, Steven Ayre <steveayre@gmail.com> wrote:
There's already a muted flag you could use for that.
On 19 April 2018 at 20:55, Abaci B <abaci64@gmail.com> wrote:
Thanks for the reply. Another idea I'm thinking of is to add a LISTEN_ONLY mflag to mod_conference and only run conference_loop_input thread on channels that don't have this flag, that way I don't need to set up a shoutcast server and have everything contained within freeswitch, does that make sense?
On Thu, Apr 19, 2018 at 3:20 PM, Giovanni Maruzzelli <gmaruzz@gmail.com> wrote:
definitely conference with two participant, and 598 on localstream
-giovanni
On Thu, Apr 19, 2018, 18:38 Abaci B <abaci64@gmail.com> wrote:
Hi, I'm trying to set up a large audio conference of over 1000 users where only 1 or 2 users are talking and the rest are just listening, but after 600-700 users the CPU usage gets too high and the audio gets choppy, I understand that mod_conference is not optimized for my use case but was wondering if someone has any suggestions on what can be done to optimize for my use case. I was also thinking that maybe there is a better alternative for what I look for, such as having just the talkers on the conference and the listeners should listen to it via mod_local_stream or maybe use something like eavesdrop for the listeners but not sure if and how much performance I would gain. Thanks for any help or input
____________________________________________________________ _____________ Professional FreeSWITCH Consulting Services: consulting@freeswitch.org http://www.freeswitchsolutions.com
Official FreeSWITCH Sites http://www.freeswitch.org http://confluence.freeswitch.org http://www.cluecon.com
FreeSWITCH-users mailing list FreeSWITCH-users@lists.freeswitch.org http://lists.freeswitch.org/mailman/listinfo/freeswitch-users UNSUBSCRIBE:http://lists.freeswitch.org/mailman/options/free switch-users http://www.freeswitch.org
____________________________________________________________ _____________ Professional FreeSWITCH Consulting Services: consulting@freeswitch.org http://www.freeswitchsolutions.com
Official FreeSWITCH Sites http://www.freeswitch.org http://confluence.freeswitch.org http://www.cluecon.com
FreeSWITCH-users mailing list FreeSWITCH-users@lists.freeswitch.org http://lists.freeswitch.org/mailman/listinfo/freeswitch-users UNSUBSCRIBE:http://lists.freeswitch.org/mailman/options/freeswitch-users http://www.freeswitch.org
_________________________________________________________________________ Professional FreeSWITCH Consulting Services: consulting@freeswitch.org http://www.freeswitchsolutions.com
Official FreeSWITCH Sites http://www.freeswitch.org http://confluence.freeswitch.org http://www.cluecon.com
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_________________________________________________________________________ Professional FreeSWITCH Consulting Services: consulting@freeswitch.org http://www.freeswitchsolutions.com
Official FreeSWITCH Sites http://www.freeswitch.org http://confluence.freeswitch.org http://www.cluecon.com
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you definitely want to have only the speakers into conference, and stream to all others. -giovanni On 19 April 2018 at 23:37, Abaci B <abaci64@gmail.com> wrote:
I was thinking that the muted flag (CAN_SPEAK?) is something that can change mid conference which means there is a chance of loosing a single frame (the last one right before muting). I was more interested in knowing as far as performance if it makes sense. not sure if this is safe but something like only starting conference_loop_launch_input if that flag is not set. I still wish there would be module that would do exactly this (something like shoutcast but local and without the shoutcast latency)
On Thu, Apr 19, 2018 at 5:19 PM, Steven Ayre <steveayre@gmail.com> wrote:
There's already a muted flag you could use for that.
On 19 April 2018 at 20:55, Abaci B <abaci64@gmail.com> wrote:
Thanks for the reply. Another idea I'm thinking of is to add a LISTEN_ONLY mflag to mod_conference and only run conference_loop_input thread on channels that don't have this flag, that way I don't need to set up a shoutcast server and have everything contained within freeswitch, does that make sense?
On Thu, Apr 19, 2018 at 3:20 PM, Giovanni Maruzzelli <gmaruzz@gmail.com> wrote:
definitely conference with two participant, and 598 on localstream
-giovanni
On Thu, Apr 19, 2018, 18:38 Abaci B <abaci64@gmail.com> wrote:
Hi, I'm trying to set up a large audio conference of over 1000 users where only 1 or 2 users are talking and the rest are just listening, but after 600-700 users the CPU usage gets too high and the audio gets choppy, I understand that mod_conference is not optimized for my use case but was wondering if someone has any suggestions on what can be done to optimize for my use case. I was also thinking that maybe there is a better alternative for what I look for, such as having just the talkers on the conference and the listeners should listen to it via mod_local_stream or maybe use something like eavesdrop for the listeners but not sure if and how much performance I would gain. Thanks for any help or input
____________________________________________________________ _____________ Professional FreeSWITCH Consulting Services: consulting@freeswitch.org http://www.freeswitchsolutions.com
Official FreeSWITCH Sites http://www.freeswitch.org http://confluence.freeswitch.org http://www.cluecon.com
FreeSWITCH-users mailing list FreeSWITCH-users@lists.freeswitch.org http://lists.freeswitch.org/mailman/listinfo/freeswitch-users UNSUBSCRIBE:http://lists.freeswitch.org/mailman/options/free switch-users http://www.freeswitch.org
____________________________________________________________ _____________ Professional FreeSWITCH Consulting Services: consulting@freeswitch.org http://www.freeswitchsolutions.com
Official FreeSWITCH Sites http://www.freeswitch.org http://confluence.freeswitch.org http://www.cluecon.com
FreeSWITCH-users mailing list FreeSWITCH-users@lists.freeswitch.org http://lists.freeswitch.org/mailman/listinfo/freeswitch-users UNSUBSCRIBE:http://lists.freeswitch.org/mailman/options/free switch-users http://www.freeswitch.org
____________________________________________________________ _____________ Professional FreeSWITCH Consulting Services: consulting@freeswitch.org http://www.freeswitchsolutions.com
Official FreeSWITCH Sites http://www.freeswitch.org http://confluence.freeswitch.org http://www.cluecon.com
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_________________________________________________________________________ Professional FreeSWITCH Consulting Services: consulting@freeswitch.org http://www.freeswitchsolutions.com
Official FreeSWITCH Sites http://www.freeswitch.org http://confluence.freeswitch.org http://www.cluecon.com
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_________________________________________________________________________ Professional FreeSWITCH Consulting Services: consulting@freeswitch.org http://www.freeswitchsolutions.com
Official FreeSWITCH Sites http://www.freeswitch.org http://confluence.freeswitch.org http://www.cluecon.com
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-- Sincerely, Giovanni Maruzzelli OpenTelecom.IT cell: +39 347 266 56 18
problem with shoutcast streaming is the extreme latency On Fri, Apr 20, 2018 at 1:30 AM, Giovanni Maruzzelli <gmaruzz@gmail.com> wrote:
you definitely want to have only the speakers into conference, and stream to all others.
-giovanni
On 19 April 2018 at 23:37, Abaci B <abaci64@gmail.com> wrote:
I was thinking that the muted flag (CAN_SPEAK?) is something that can change mid conference which means there is a chance of loosing a single frame (the last one right before muting). I was more interested in knowing as far as performance if it makes sense. not sure if this is safe but something like only starting conference_loop_launch_input if that flag is not set. I still wish there would be module that would do exactly this (something like shoutcast but local and without the shoutcast latency)
On Thu, Apr 19, 2018 at 5:19 PM, Steven Ayre <steveayre@gmail.com> wrote:
There's already a muted flag you could use for that.
On 19 April 2018 at 20:55, Abaci B <abaci64@gmail.com> wrote:
Thanks for the reply. Another idea I'm thinking of is to add a LISTEN_ONLY mflag to mod_conference and only run conference_loop_input thread on channels that don't have this flag, that way I don't need to set up a shoutcast server and have everything contained within freeswitch, does that make sense?
On Thu, Apr 19, 2018 at 3:20 PM, Giovanni Maruzzelli <gmaruzz@gmail.com
wrote:
definitely conference with two participant, and 598 on localstream
-giovanni
On Thu, Apr 19, 2018, 18:38 Abaci B <abaci64@gmail.com> wrote:
Hi, I'm trying to set up a large audio conference of over 1000 users where only 1 or 2 users are talking and the rest are just listening, but after 600-700 users the CPU usage gets too high and the audio gets choppy, I understand that mod_conference is not optimized for my use case but was wondering if someone has any suggestions on what can be done to optimize for my use case. I was also thinking that maybe there is a better alternative for what I look for, such as having just the talkers on the conference and the listeners should listen to it via mod_local_stream or maybe use something like eavesdrop for the listeners but not sure if and how much performance I would gain. Thanks for any help or input
____________________________________________________________ _____________ Professional FreeSWITCH Consulting Services: consulting@freeswitch.org http://www.freeswitchsolutions.com
Official FreeSWITCH Sites http://www.freeswitch.org http://confluence.freeswitch.org http://www.cluecon.com
FreeSWITCH-users mailing list FreeSWITCH-users@lists.freeswitch.org http://lists.freeswitch.org/mailman/listinfo/freeswitch-users UNSUBSCRIBE:http://lists.freeswitch.org/mailman/options/free switch-users http://www.freeswitch.org
____________________________________________________________ _____________ Professional FreeSWITCH Consulting Services: consulting@freeswitch.org http://www.freeswitchsolutions.com
Official FreeSWITCH Sites http://www.freeswitch.org http://confluence.freeswitch.org http://www.cluecon.com
FreeSWITCH-users mailing list FreeSWITCH-users@lists.freeswitch.org http://lists.freeswitch.org/mailman/listinfo/freeswitch-users UNSUBSCRIBE:http://lists.freeswitch.org/mailman/options/free switch-users http://www.freeswitch.org
____________________________________________________________ _____________ Professional FreeSWITCH Consulting Services: consulting@freeswitch.org http://www.freeswitchsolutions.com
Official FreeSWITCH Sites http://www.freeswitch.org http://confluence.freeswitch.org http://www.cluecon.com
FreeSWITCH-users mailing list FreeSWITCH-users@lists.freeswitch.org http://lists.freeswitch.org/mailman/listinfo/freeswitch-users UNSUBSCRIBE:http://lists.freeswitch.org/mailman/options/free switch-users http://www.freeswitch.org
____________________________________________________________ _____________ Professional FreeSWITCH Consulting Services: consulting@freeswitch.org http://www.freeswitchsolutions.com
Official FreeSWITCH Sites http://www.freeswitch.org http://confluence.freeswitch.org http://www.cluecon.com
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_________________________________________________________________________ Professional FreeSWITCH Consulting Services: consulting@freeswitch.org http://www.freeswitchsolutions.com
Official FreeSWITCH Sites http://www.freeswitch.org http://confluence.freeswitch.org http://www.cluecon.com
FreeSWITCH-users mailing list FreeSWITCH-users@lists.freeswitch.org http://lists.freeswitch.org/mailman/listinfo/freeswitch-users UNSUBSCRIBE:http://lists.freeswitch.org/mailman/options/freeswitch-users http://www.freeswitch.org
--
Sincerely,
Giovanni Maruzzelli OpenTelecom.IT cell: +39 347 266 56 18
_________________________________________________________________________ Professional FreeSWITCH Consulting Services: consulting@freeswitch.org http://www.freeswitchsolutions.com
Official FreeSWITCH Sites http://www.freeswitch.org http://confluence.freeswitch.org http://www.cluecon.com
FreeSWITCH-users mailing list FreeSWITCH-users@lists.freeswitch.org http://lists.freeswitch.org/mailman/listinfo/freeswitch-users UNSUBSCRIBE:http://lists.freeswitch.org/mailman/options/freeswitch-users http://www.freeswitch.org
a conference with 1000 members demands huge resources... and this is not efficient if only 2-5% of members will actually talk. you need to keep the actual conference to the minimum number of "speakers" and move listeners to a streaming "service". so, focus on how to get your entire conference streamed somewhere. another thing to consider.... do the "listeners" really need to be in time sync with the conference ? They will just hear the conversation from the conference a bit later... thats all. T. On 20 April 2018 at 14:43, Abaci B <abaci64@gmail.com> wrote:
problem with shoutcast streaming is the extreme latency
On Fri, Apr 20, 2018 at 1:30 AM, Giovanni Maruzzelli <gmaruzz@gmail.com> wrote:
you definitely want to have only the speakers into conference, and stream to all others.
-giovanni
On 19 April 2018 at 23:37, Abaci B <abaci64@gmail.com> wrote:
I was thinking that the muted flag (CAN_SPEAK?) is something that can change mid conference which means there is a chance of loosing a single frame (the last one right before muting). I was more interested in knowing as far as performance if it makes sense. not sure if this is safe but something like only starting conference_loop_launch_input if that flag is not set. I still wish there would be module that would do exactly this (something like shoutcast but local and without the shoutcast latency)
On Thu, Apr 19, 2018 at 5:19 PM, Steven Ayre <steveayre@gmail.com> wrote:
There's already a muted flag you could use for that.
On 19 April 2018 at 20:55, Abaci B <abaci64@gmail.com> wrote:
Thanks for the reply. Another idea I'm thinking of is to add a LISTEN_ONLY mflag to mod_conference and only run conference_loop_input thread on channels that don't have this flag, that way I don't need to set up a shoutcast server and have everything contained within freeswitch, does that make sense?
On Thu, Apr 19, 2018 at 3:20 PM, Giovanni Maruzzelli < gmaruzz@gmail.com> wrote:
definitely conference with two participant, and 598 on localstream
-giovanni
On Thu, Apr 19, 2018, 18:38 Abaci B <abaci64@gmail.com> wrote:
> Hi, > I'm trying to set up a large audio conference of over 1000 users > where only 1 or 2 users are talking and the rest are just listening, but > after 600-700 users the CPU usage gets too high and the audio gets choppy, > I understand that mod_conference is not optimized for my use case but was > wondering if someone has any suggestions on what can be done to optimize > for my use case. > I was also thinking that maybe there is a better alternative for > what I look for, such as having just the talkers on the conference and the > listeners should listen to it via mod_local_stream or maybe use something > like eavesdrop for the listeners but not sure if and how much performance I > would gain. > Thanks for any help or input > > ____________________________________________________________ > _____________ > Professional FreeSWITCH Consulting Services: > consulting@freeswitch.org > http://www.freeswitchsolutions.com > > Official FreeSWITCH Sites > http://www.freeswitch.org > http://confluence.freeswitch.org > http://www.cluecon.com > > FreeSWITCH-users mailing list > FreeSWITCH-users@lists.freeswitch.org > http://lists.freeswitch.org/mailman/listinfo/freeswitch-users > UNSUBSCRIBE:http://lists.freeswitch.org/mailman/options/free > switch-users > http://www.freeswitch.org
____________________________________________________________ _____________ Professional FreeSWITCH Consulting Services: consulting@freeswitch.org http://www.freeswitchsolutions.com
Official FreeSWITCH Sites http://www.freeswitch.org http://confluence.freeswitch.org http://www.cluecon.com
FreeSWITCH-users mailing list FreeSWITCH-users@lists.freeswitch.org http://lists.freeswitch.org/mailman/listinfo/freeswitch-users UNSUBSCRIBE:http://lists.freeswitch.org/mailman/options/free switch-users http://www.freeswitch.org
____________________________________________________________ _____________ Professional FreeSWITCH Consulting Services: consulting@freeswitch.org http://www.freeswitchsolutions.com
Official FreeSWITCH Sites http://www.freeswitch.org http://confluence.freeswitch.org http://www.cluecon.com
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____________________________________________________________ _____________ Professional FreeSWITCH Consulting Services: consulting@freeswitch.org http://www.freeswitchsolutions.com
Official FreeSWITCH Sites http://www.freeswitch.org http://confluence.freeswitch.org http://www.cluecon.com
FreeSWITCH-users mailing list FreeSWITCH-users@lists.freeswitch.org http://lists.freeswitch.org/mailman/listinfo/freeswitch-users UNSUBSCRIBE:http://lists.freeswitch.org/mailman/options/free switch-users http://www.freeswitch.org
____________________________________________________________ _____________ Professional FreeSWITCH Consulting Services: consulting@freeswitch.org http://www.freeswitchsolutions.com
Official FreeSWITCH Sites http://www.freeswitch.org http://confluence.freeswitch.org http://www.cluecon.com
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--
Sincerely,
Giovanni Maruzzelli OpenTelecom.IT cell: +39 347 266 56 18
_________________________________________________________________________ Professional FreeSWITCH Consulting Services: consulting@freeswitch.org http://www.freeswitchsolutions.com
Official FreeSWITCH Sites http://www.freeswitch.org http://confluence.freeswitch.org http://www.cluecon.com
FreeSWITCH-users mailing list FreeSWITCH-users@lists.freeswitch.org http://lists.freeswitch.org/mailman/listinfo/freeswitch-users UNSUBSCRIBE:http://lists.freeswitch.org/mailman/options/freeswitch-users http://www.freeswitch.org
_________________________________________________________________________ Professional FreeSWITCH Consulting Services: consulting@freeswitch.org http://www.freeswitchsolutions.com
Official FreeSWITCH Sites http://www.freeswitch.org http://confluence.freeswitch.org http://www.cluecon.com
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I do understand that the way mod_conference work it is not efficient for my use case, my question is about the best alternative. Streaming would be ideal if it wouldn't be for the latency, since users need to be able to switch to talk mode there is no way a latency of 5-10 seconds (or possibly more) is acceptable. Another option is to use eavesdrop which I plan on testing next week to see if it scales, if someone has any input on it I would appreciate. The next option would be to optimize mod_conference for this use case, I started looking at the code and identified some places that performance can be optimized but may need to hire someone with better C skills to do the actual coding. another possibility may be, to use an RTP proxy that would just distribute the RTP to all callers, this would give the best performance but would limit features. Last option would be to develop a new module optimized for low latency streaming, but leave that as a last resort. On Fri, Apr 20, 2018 at 1:15 PM, Tihomir Culjaga <tculjaga@gmail.com> wrote:
a conference with 1000 members demands huge resources... and this is not efficient if only 2-5% of members will actually talk. you need to keep the actual conference to the minimum number of "speakers" and move listeners to a streaming "service".
so, focus on how to get your entire conference streamed somewhere.
another thing to consider.... do the "listeners" really need to be in time sync with the conference ? They will just hear the conversation from the conference a bit later... thats all.
T.
On 20 April 2018 at 14:43, Abaci B <abaci64@gmail.com> wrote:
problem with shoutcast streaming is the extreme latency
On Fri, Apr 20, 2018 at 1:30 AM, Giovanni Maruzzelli <gmaruzz@gmail.com> wrote:
you definitely want to have only the speakers into conference, and stream to all others.
-giovanni
On 19 April 2018 at 23:37, Abaci B <abaci64@gmail.com> wrote:
I was thinking that the muted flag (CAN_SPEAK?) is something that can change mid conference which means there is a chance of loosing a single frame (the last one right before muting). I was more interested in knowing as far as performance if it makes sense. not sure if this is safe but something like only starting conference_loop_launch_input if that flag is not set. I still wish there would be module that would do exactly this (something like shoutcast but local and without the shoutcast latency)
On Thu, Apr 19, 2018 at 5:19 PM, Steven Ayre <steveayre@gmail.com> wrote:
There's already a muted flag you could use for that.
On 19 April 2018 at 20:55, Abaci B <abaci64@gmail.com> wrote:
Thanks for the reply. Another idea I'm thinking of is to add a LISTEN_ONLY mflag to mod_conference and only run conference_loop_input thread on channels that don't have this flag, that way I don't need to set up a shoutcast server and have everything contained within freeswitch, does that make sense?
On Thu, Apr 19, 2018 at 3:20 PM, Giovanni Maruzzelli < gmaruzz@gmail.com> wrote:
> definitely conference with two participant, and 598 on localstream > > -giovanni > > On Thu, Apr 19, 2018, 18:38 Abaci B <abaci64@gmail.com> wrote: > >> Hi, >> I'm trying to set up a large audio conference of over 1000 users >> where only 1 or 2 users are talking and the rest are just listening, but >> after 600-700 users the CPU usage gets too high and the audio gets choppy, >> I understand that mod_conference is not optimized for my use case but was >> wondering if someone has any suggestions on what can be done to optimize >> for my use case. >> I was also thinking that maybe there is a better alternative for >> what I look for, such as having just the talkers on the conference and the >> listeners should listen to it via mod_local_stream or maybe use something >> like eavesdrop for the listeners but not sure if and how much performance I >> would gain. >> Thanks for any help or input >> >> ____________________________________________________________ >> _____________ >> Professional FreeSWITCH Consulting Services: >> consulting@freeswitch.org >> http://www.freeswitchsolutions.com >> >> Official FreeSWITCH Sites >> http://www.freeswitch.org >> http://confluence.freeswitch.org >> http://www.cluecon.com >> >> FreeSWITCH-users mailing list >> FreeSWITCH-users@lists.freeswitch.org >> http://lists.freeswitch.org/mailman/listinfo/freeswitch-users >> UNSUBSCRIBE:http://lists.freeswitch.org/mailman/options/free >> switch-users >> http://www.freeswitch.org > > > ____________________________________________________________ > _____________ > Professional FreeSWITCH Consulting Services: > consulting@freeswitch.org > http://www.freeswitchsolutions.com > > Official FreeSWITCH Sites > http://www.freeswitch.org > http://confluence.freeswitch.org > http://www.cluecon.com > > FreeSWITCH-users mailing list > FreeSWITCH-users@lists.freeswitch.org > http://lists.freeswitch.org/mailman/listinfo/freeswitch-users > UNSUBSCRIBE:http://lists.freeswitch.org/mailman/options/free > switch-users > http://www.freeswitch.org >
____________________________________________________________ _____________ Professional FreeSWITCH Consulting Services: consulting@freeswitch.org http://www.freeswitchsolutions.com
Official FreeSWITCH Sites http://www.freeswitch.org http://confluence.freeswitch.org http://www.cluecon.com
FreeSWITCH-users mailing list FreeSWITCH-users@lists.freeswitch.org http://lists.freeswitch.org/mailman/listinfo/freeswitch-users UNSUBSCRIBE:http://lists.freeswitch.org/mailman/options/free switch-users http://www.freeswitch.org
____________________________________________________________ _____________ Professional FreeSWITCH Consulting Services: consulting@freeswitch.org http://www.freeswitchsolutions.com
Official FreeSWITCH Sites http://www.freeswitch.org http://confluence.freeswitch.org http://www.cluecon.com
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____________________________________________________________ _____________ Professional FreeSWITCH Consulting Services: consulting@freeswitch.org http://www.freeswitchsolutions.com
Official FreeSWITCH Sites http://www.freeswitch.org http://confluence.freeswitch.org http://www.cluecon.com
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--
Sincerely,
Giovanni Maruzzelli OpenTelecom.IT cell: +39 347 266 56 18
____________________________________________________________ _____________ Professional FreeSWITCH Consulting Services: consulting@freeswitch.org http://www.freeswitchsolutions.com
Official FreeSWITCH Sites http://www.freeswitch.org http://confluence.freeswitch.org http://www.cluecon.com
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_________________________________________________________________________ Professional FreeSWITCH Consulting Services: consulting@freeswitch.org http://www.freeswitchsolutions.com
Official FreeSWITCH Sites http://www.freeswitch.org http://confluence.freeswitch.org http://www.cluecon.com
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_________________________________________________________________________ Professional FreeSWITCH Consulting Services: consulting@freeswitch.org http://www.freeswitchsolutions.com
Official FreeSWITCH Sites http://www.freeswitch.org http://confluence.freeswitch.org http://www.cluecon.com
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This won't help much but here's our experience. Had a similar requirement and posted here last year about it. Luckily my needs were for fewer listeners (30-50) and running them all in mod_conference (with listeners muted) was feasible. But it's not elegant (if it's indeed the case) that all listeners have a jitter buffer and audio decoder that's being allocated but not being used when muted. The upside is we could implement a "barge in" function to allow listeners to join the conference via DTMF PIN. For our application it's not a risk and it's a neat feature. On Fri, Apr 20, 2018 at 1:29 PM, Abaci B <abaci64@gmail.com> wrote:
I do understand that the way mod_conference work it is not efficient for my use case, my question is about the best alternative. Streaming would be ideal if it wouldn't be for the latency, since users need to be able to switch to talk mode there is no way a latency of 5-10 seconds (or possibly more) is acceptable. Another option is to use eavesdrop which I plan on testing next week to see if it scales, if someone has any input on it I would appreciate. The next option would be to optimize mod_conference for this use case, I started looking at the code and identified some places that performance can be optimized but may need to hire someone with better C skills to do the actual coding. another possibility may be, to use an RTP proxy that would just distribute the RTP to all callers, this would give the best performance but would limit features. Last option would be to develop a new module optimized for low latency streaming, but leave that as a last resort.
On Fri, Apr 20, 2018 at 1:15 PM, Tihomir Culjaga <tculjaga@gmail.com> wrote:
a conference with 1000 members demands huge resources... and this is not efficient if only 2-5% of members will actually talk. you need to keep the actual conference to the minimum number of "speakers" and move listeners to a streaming "service".
so, focus on how to get your entire conference streamed somewhere.
another thing to consider.... do the "listeners" really need to be in time sync with the conference ? They will just hear the conversation from the conference a bit later... thats all.
T.
On 20 April 2018 at 14:43, Abaci B <abaci64@gmail.com> wrote:
problem with shoutcast streaming is the extreme latency
On Fri, Apr 20, 2018 at 1:30 AM, Giovanni Maruzzelli <gmaruzz@gmail.com> wrote:
you definitely want to have only the speakers into conference, and stream to all others.
-giovanni
On 19 April 2018 at 23:37, Abaci B <abaci64@gmail.com> wrote:
I was thinking that the muted flag (CAN_SPEAK?) is something that can change mid conference which means there is a chance of loosing a single frame (the last one right before muting). I was more interested in knowing as far as performance if it makes sense. not sure if this is safe but something like only starting conference_loop_launch_input if that flag is not set. I still wish there would be module that would do exactly this (something like shoutcast but local and without the shoutcast latency)
On Thu, Apr 19, 2018 at 5:19 PM, Steven Ayre <steveayre@gmail.com> wrote:
There's already a muted flag you could use for that.
On 19 April 2018 at 20:55, Abaci B <abaci64@gmail.com> wrote:
> Thanks for the reply. > Another idea I'm thinking of is to add a LISTEN_ONLY mflag to > mod_conference and only run conference_loop_input thread on channels that > don't have this flag, that way I don't need to set up a shoutcast server > and have everything contained within freeswitch, does that make sense? > > On Thu, Apr 19, 2018 at 3:20 PM, Giovanni Maruzzelli < > gmaruzz@gmail.com> wrote: > >> definitely conference with two participant, and 598 on localstream >> >> -giovanni >> >> On Thu, Apr 19, 2018, 18:38 Abaci B <abaci64@gmail.com> wrote: >> >>> Hi, >>> I'm trying to set up a large audio conference of over 1000 users >>> where only 1 or 2 users are talking and the rest are just listening, but >>> after 600-700 users the CPU usage gets too high and the audio gets choppy, >>> I understand that mod_conference is not optimized for my use case but was >>> wondering if someone has any suggestions on what can be done to optimize >>> for my use case. >>> I was also thinking that maybe there is a better alternative for >>> what I look for, such as having just the talkers on the conference and the >>> listeners should listen to it via mod_local_stream or maybe use something >>> like eavesdrop for the listeners but not sure if and how much performance I >>> would gain. >>> Thanks for any help or input >>> >>> ____________________________________________________________ >>> _____________ >>> Professional FreeSWITCH Consulting Services: >>> consulting@freeswitch.org >>> http://www.freeswitchsolutions.com >>> >>> Official FreeSWITCH Sites >>> http://www.freeswitch.org >>> http://confluence.freeswitch.org >>> http://www.cluecon.com >>> >>> FreeSWITCH-users mailing list >>> FreeSWITCH-users@lists.freeswitch.org >>> http://lists.freeswitch.org/mailman/listinfo/freeswitch-users >>> UNSUBSCRIBE:http://lists.freeswitch.org/mailman/options/free >>> switch-users >>> http://www.freeswitch.org >> >> >> ____________________________________________________________ >> _____________ >> Professional FreeSWITCH Consulting Services: >> consulting@freeswitch.org >> http://www.freeswitchsolutions.com >> >> Official FreeSWITCH Sites >> http://www.freeswitch.org >> http://confluence.freeswitch.org >> http://www.cluecon.com >> >> FreeSWITCH-users mailing list >> FreeSWITCH-users@lists.freeswitch.org >> http://lists.freeswitch.org/mailman/listinfo/freeswitch-users >> UNSUBSCRIBE:http://lists.freeswitch.org/mailman/options/free >> switch-users >> http://www.freeswitch.org >> > > > ____________________________________________________________ > _____________ > Professional FreeSWITCH Consulting Services: > consulting@freeswitch.org > http://www.freeswitchsolutions.com > > Official FreeSWITCH Sites > http://www.freeswitch.org > http://confluence.freeswitch.org > http://www.cluecon.com > > FreeSWITCH-users mailing list > FreeSWITCH-users@lists.freeswitch.org > http://lists.freeswitch.org/mailman/listinfo/freeswitch-users > UNSUBSCRIBE:http://lists.freeswitch.org/mailman/options/free > switch-users > http://www.freeswitch.org >
____________________________________________________________ _____________ Professional FreeSWITCH Consulting Services: consulting@freeswitch.org http://www.freeswitchsolutions.com
Official FreeSWITCH Sites http://www.freeswitch.org http://confluence.freeswitch.org http://www.cluecon.com
FreeSWITCH-users mailing list FreeSWITCH-users@lists.freeswitch.org http://lists.freeswitch.org/mailman/listinfo/freeswitch-users UNSUBSCRIBE:http://lists.freeswitch.org/mailman/options/free switch-users http://www.freeswitch.org
____________________________________________________________ _____________ Professional FreeSWITCH Consulting Services: consulting@freeswitch.org http://www.freeswitchsolutions.com
Official FreeSWITCH Sites http://www.freeswitch.org http://confluence.freeswitch.org http://www.cluecon.com
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--
Sincerely,
Giovanni Maruzzelli OpenTelecom.IT cell: +39 347 266 56 18
____________________________________________________________ _____________ Professional FreeSWITCH Consulting Services: consulting@freeswitch.org http://www.freeswitchsolutions.com
Official FreeSWITCH Sites http://www.freeswitch.org http://confluence.freeswitch.org http://www.cluecon.com
FreeSWITCH-users mailing list FreeSWITCH-users@lists.freeswitch.org http://lists.freeswitch.org/mailman/listinfo/freeswitch-users UNSUBSCRIBE:http://lists.freeswitch.org/mailman/options/free switch-users http://www.freeswitch.org
____________________________________________________________ _____________ Professional FreeSWITCH Consulting Services: consulting@freeswitch.org http://www.freeswitchsolutions.com
Official FreeSWITCH Sites http://www.freeswitch.org http://confluence.freeswitch.org http://www.cluecon.com
FreeSWITCH-users mailing list FreeSWITCH-users@lists.freeswitch.org http://lists.freeswitch.org/mailman/listinfo/freeswitch-users UNSUBSCRIBE:http://lists.freeswitch.org/mailman/options/freeswitch-users http://www.freeswitch.org
_________________________________________________________________________ Professional FreeSWITCH Consulting Services: consulting@freeswitch.org http://www.freeswitchsolutions.com
Official FreeSWITCH Sites http://www.freeswitch.org http://confluence.freeswitch.org http://www.cluecon.com
FreeSWITCH-users mailing list FreeSWITCH-users@lists.freeswitch.org http://lists.freeswitch.org/mailman/listinfo/freeswitch-users UNSUBSCRIBE:http://lists.freeswitch.org/mailman/options/freeswitch-users http://www.freeswitch.org
_________________________________________________________________________ Professional FreeSWITCH Consulting Services: consulting@freeswitch.org http://www.freeswitchsolutions.com
Official FreeSWITCH Sites http://www.freeswitch.org http://confluence.freeswitch.org http://www.cluecon.com
FreeSWITCH-users mailing list FreeSWITCH-users@lists.freeswitch.org http://lists.freeswitch.org/mailman/listinfo/freeswitch-users UNSUBSCRIBE:http://lists.freeswitch.org/mailman/options/freeswitch-users http://www.freeswitch.org
Latency is often caused by buffer and high quality video. if you really need zero latency so find a way to set the buffer stream to zero and use a very fast video encoding. On 4/20/2018 10:29 AM, Abaci B wrote:
I do understand that the way mod_conference work it is not efficient for my use case, my question is about the best alternative. Streaming would be ideal if it wouldn't be for the latency, since users need to be able to switch to talk mode there is no way a latency of 5-10 seconds (or possibly more) is acceptable. Another option is to use eavesdrop which I plan on testing next week to see if it scales, if someone has any input on it I would appreciate. The next option would be to optimize mod_conference for this use case, I started looking at the code and identified some places that performance can be optimized but may need to hire someone with better C skills to do the actual coding. another possibility may be, to use an RTP proxy that would just distribute the RTP to all callers, this would give the best performance but would limit features. Last option would be to develop a new module optimized for low latency streaming, but leave that as a last resort.
On Fri, Apr 20, 2018 at 1:15 PM, Tihomir Culjaga <tculjaga@gmail.com <mailto:tculjaga@gmail.com>> wrote:
a conference with 1000 members demands huge resources... and this is not efficient if only 2-5% of members will actually talk. you need to keep the actual conference to the minimum number of "speakers" and move listeners to a streaming "service".
so, focus on how to get your entire conference streamed somewhere.
another thing to consider.... do the "listeners" really need to be in time sync with the conference ? They will just hear the conversation from the conference a bit later... thats all.
T.
On 20 April 2018 at 14:43, Abaci B <abaci64@gmail.com <mailto:abaci64@gmail.com>> wrote:
problem with shoutcast streaming is the extreme latency
On Fri, Apr 20, 2018 at 1:30 AM, Giovanni Maruzzelli <gmaruzz@gmail.com <mailto:gmaruzz@gmail.com>> wrote:
you definitely want to have only the speakers into conference, and stream to all others.
-giovanni
On 19 April 2018 at 23:37, Abaci B <abaci64@gmail.com <mailto:abaci64@gmail.com>> wrote:
I was thinking that the muted flag (CAN_SPEAK?) is something that can change mid conference which means there is a chance of loosing a single frame (the last one right before muting). I was more interested in knowing as far as performance if it makes sense. not sure if this is safe but something like only starting conference_loop_launch_input if that flag is not set. I still wish there would be module that would do exactly this (something like shoutcast but local and without the shoutcast latency)
On Thu, Apr 19, 2018 at 5:19 PM, Steven Ayre <steveayre@gmail.com <mailto:steveayre@gmail.com>> wrote:
There's already a muted flag you could use for that.
On 19 April 2018 at 20:55, Abaci B <abaci64@gmail.com <mailto:abaci64@gmail.com>> wrote:
Thanks for the reply. Another idea I'm thinking of is to add a LISTEN_ONLY mflag to mod_conference and only run conference_loop_input thread on channels that don't have this flag, that way I don't need to set up a shoutcast server and have everything contained within freeswitch, does that make sense?
On Thu, Apr 19, 2018 at 3:20 PM, Giovanni Maruzzelli <gmaruzz@gmail.com <mailto:gmaruzz@gmail.com>> wrote:
definitely conference with two participant, and 598 on localstream
-giovanni
On Thu, Apr 19, 2018, 18:38 Abaci B <abaci64@gmail.com <mailto:abaci64@gmail.com>> wrote:
Hi, I'm trying to set up a large audio conference of over 1000 users where only 1 or 2 users are talking and the rest are just listening, but after 600-700 users the CPU usage gets too high and the audio gets choppy, I understand that mod_conference is not optimized for my use case but was wondering if someone has any suggestions on what can be done to optimize for my use case. I was also thinking that maybe there is a better alternative for what I look for, such as having just the talkers on the conference and the listeners should listen to it via mod_local_stream or maybe use something like eavesdrop for the listeners but not sure if and how much performance I would gain. Thanks for any help or input
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--
Sincerely,
Giovanni Maruzzelli OpenTelecom.IT cell: +39 347 266 56 18
_________________________________________________________________________ Professional FreeSWITCH Consulting Services: consulting@freeswitch.org <mailto:consulting@freeswitch.org> http://www.freeswitchsolutions.com <http://www.freeswitchsolutions.com>
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is an audio conference. what I would look into is something on these lines: have a conference with only the speakers. Put the listeners on music on hold, and use the conference output as music on hold stream. Give the listeners a bind meta key for being connected to the conference if they need to speak. -giovanni On 20 April 2018 at 21:45, Madovsky <infos@madovsky.org> wrote:
Latency is often caused by buffer and high quality video.
if you really need zero latency so find a way to set the buffer stream to zero and use
a very fast video encoding. On 4/20/2018 10:29 AM, Abaci B wrote:
I do understand that the way mod_conference work it is not efficient for my use case, my question is about the best alternative. Streaming would be ideal if it wouldn't be for the latency, since users need to be able to switch to talk mode there is no way a latency of 5-10 seconds (or possibly more) is acceptable. Another option is to use eavesdrop which I plan on testing next week to see if it scales, if someone has any input on it I would appreciate. The next option would be to optimize mod_conference for this use case, I started looking at the code and identified some places that performance can be optimized but may need to hire someone with better C skills to do the actual coding. another possibility may be, to use an RTP proxy that would just distribute the RTP to all callers, this would give the best performance but would limit features. Last option would be to develop a new module optimized for low latency streaming, but leave that as a last resort.
On Fri, Apr 20, 2018 at 1:15 PM, Tihomir Culjaga <tculjaga@gmail.com> wrote:
a conference with 1000 members demands huge resources... and this is not efficient if only 2-5% of members will actually talk. you need to keep the actual conference to the minimum number of "speakers" and move listeners to a streaming "service".
so, focus on how to get your entire conference streamed somewhere.
another thing to consider.... do the "listeners" really need to be in time sync with the conference ? They will just hear the conversation from the conference a bit later... thats all.
T.
On 20 April 2018 at 14:43, Abaci B <abaci64@gmail.com> wrote:
problem with shoutcast streaming is the extreme latency
On Fri, Apr 20, 2018 at 1:30 AM, Giovanni Maruzzelli <gmaruzz@gmail.com> wrote:
you definitely want to have only the speakers into conference, and stream to all others.
-giovanni
On 19 April 2018 at 23:37, Abaci B <abaci64@gmail.com> wrote:
I was thinking that the muted flag (CAN_SPEAK?) is something that can change mid conference which means there is a chance of loosing a single frame (the last one right before muting). I was more interested in knowing as far as performance if it makes sense. not sure if this is safe but something like only starting conference_loop_launch_input if that flag is not set. I still wish there would be module that would do exactly this (something like shoutcast but local and without the shoutcast latency)
On Thu, Apr 19, 2018 at 5:19 PM, Steven Ayre <steveayre@gmail.com> wrote:
There's already a muted flag you could use for that.
On 19 April 2018 at 20:55, Abaci B <abaci64@gmail.com> wrote:
> Thanks for the reply. > Another idea I'm thinking of is to add a LISTEN_ONLY mflag to > mod_conference and only run conference_loop_input thread on channels that > don't have this flag, that way I don't need to set up a shoutcast server > and have everything contained within freeswitch, does that make sense? > > On Thu, Apr 19, 2018 at 3:20 PM, Giovanni Maruzzelli < > gmaruzz@gmail.com> wrote: > >> definitely conference with two participant, and 598 on localstream >> >> -giovanni >> >> On Thu, Apr 19, 2018, 18:38 Abaci B <abaci64@gmail.com> wrote: >> >>> Hi, >>> I'm trying to set up a large audio conference of over 1000 users >>> where only 1 or 2 users are talking and the rest are just listening, but >>> after 600-700 users the CPU usage gets too high and the audio gets choppy, >>> I understand that mod_conference is not optimized for my use case but was >>> wondering if someone has any suggestions on what can be done to optimize >>> for my use case. >>> I was also thinking that maybe there is a better alternative for >>> what I look for, such as having just the talkers on the conference and the >>> listeners should listen to it via mod_local_stream or maybe use something >>> like eavesdrop for the listeners but not sure if and how much performance I >>> would gain. >>> Thanks for any help or input >>> >>> ____________________________________________________________ >>> _____________ >>> Professional FreeSWITCH Consulting Services: >>> consulting@freeswitch.org >>> http://www.freeswitchsolutions.com >>> >>> Official FreeSWITCH Sites >>> http://www.freeswitch.org >>> http://confluence.freeswitch.org >>> http://www.cluecon.com >>> >>> FreeSWITCH-users mailing list >>> FreeSWITCH-users@lists.freeswitch.org >>> http://lists.freeswitch.org/mailman/listinfo/freeswitch-users >>> UNSUBSCRIBE:http://lists.freeswitch.org/mailman/options/free >>> switch-users >>> http://www.freeswitch.org >> >> >> ____________________________________________________________ >> _____________ >> Professional FreeSWITCH Consulting Services: >> consulting@freeswitch.org >> http://www.freeswitchsolutions.com >> >> Official FreeSWITCH Sites >> http://www.freeswitch.org >> http://confluence.freeswitch.org >> http://www.cluecon.com >> >> FreeSWITCH-users mailing list >> FreeSWITCH-users@lists.freeswitch.org >> http://lists.freeswitch.org/mailman/listinfo/freeswitch-users >> UNSUBSCRIBE:http://lists.freeswitch.org/mailman/options/free >> switch-users >> http://www.freeswitch.org >> > > > ____________________________________________________________ > _____________ > Professional FreeSWITCH Consulting Services: > consulting@freeswitch.org > http://www.freeswitchsolutions.com > > Official FreeSWITCH Sites > http://www.freeswitch.org > http://confluence.freeswitch.org > http://www.cluecon.com > > FreeSWITCH-users mailing list > FreeSWITCH-users@lists.freeswitch.org > http://lists.freeswitch.org/mailman/listinfo/freeswitch-users > UNSUBSCRIBE:http://lists.freeswitch.org/mailman/options/free > switch-users > http://www.freeswitch.org >
____________________________________________________________ _____________ Professional FreeSWITCH Consulting Services: consulting@freeswitch.org http://www.freeswitchsolutions.com
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Sincerely,
Giovanni Maruzzelli OpenTelecom.IT cell: +39 347 266 56 18
____________________________________________________________ _____________ Professional FreeSWITCH Consulting Services: consulting@freeswitch.org http://www.freeswitchsolutions.com
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my mistake... but buffer to close to zero for audio is also a good start.... why not to grab the conferencer stream to a live point the if someone wants to talk so a 1 click call to the conference.... On 4/21/2018 1:43 AM, Giovanni Maruzzelli wrote:
is an audio conference.
what I would look into is something on these lines: have a conference with only the speakers. Put the listeners on music on hold, and use the conference output as music on hold stream. Give the listeners a bind meta key for being connected to the conference if they need to speak.
-giovanni
On 20 April 2018 at 21:45, Madovsky <infos@madovsky.org <mailto:infos@madovsky.org>> wrote:
Latency is often caused by buffer and high quality video.
if you really need zero latency so find a way to set the buffer stream to zero and use
a very fast video encoding.
On 4/20/2018 10:29 AM, Abaci B wrote:
I do understand that the way mod_conference work it is not efficient for my use case, my question is about the best alternative. Streaming would be ideal if it wouldn't be for the latency, since users need to be able to switch to talk mode there is no way a latency of 5-10 seconds (or possibly more) is acceptable. Another option is to use eavesdrop which I plan on testing next week to see if it scales, if someone has any input on it I would appreciate. The next option would be to optimize mod_conference for this use case, I started looking at the code and identified some places that performance can be optimized but may need to hire someone with better C skills to do the actual coding. another possibility may be, to use an RTP proxy that would just distribute the RTP to all callers, this would give the best performance but would limit features. Last option would be to develop a new module optimized for low latency streaming, but leave that as a last resort.
On Fri, Apr 20, 2018 at 1:15 PM, Tihomir Culjaga <tculjaga@gmail.com <mailto:tculjaga@gmail.com>> wrote:
a conference with 1000 members demands huge resources... and this is not efficient if only 2-5% of members will actually talk. you need to keep the actual conference to the minimum number of "speakers" and move listeners to a streaming "service".
so, focus on how to get your entire conference streamed somewhere.
another thing to consider.... do the "listeners" really need to be in time sync with the conference ? They will just hear the conversation from the conference a bit later... thats all.
T.
On 20 April 2018 at 14:43, Abaci B <abaci64@gmail.com <mailto:abaci64@gmail.com>> wrote:
problem with shoutcast streaming is the extreme latency
On Fri, Apr 20, 2018 at 1:30 AM, Giovanni Maruzzelli <gmaruzz@gmail.com <mailto:gmaruzz@gmail.com>> wrote:
you definitely want to have only the speakers into conference, and stream to all others.
-giovanni
On 19 April 2018 at 23:37, Abaci B <abaci64@gmail.com <mailto:abaci64@gmail.com>> wrote:
I was thinking that the muted flag (CAN_SPEAK?) is something that can change mid conference which means there is a chance of loosing a single frame (the last one right before muting). I was more interested in knowing as far as performance if it makes sense. not sure if this is safe but something like only starting conference_loop_launch_input if that flag is not set. I still wish there would be module that would do exactly this (something like shoutcast but local and without the shoutcast latency)
On Thu, Apr 19, 2018 at 5:19 PM, Steven Ayre <steveayre@gmail.com <mailto:steveayre@gmail.com>> wrote:
There's already a muted flag you could use for that.
On 19 April 2018 at 20:55, Abaci B <abaci64@gmail.com <mailto:abaci64@gmail.com>> wrote:
Thanks for the reply. Another idea I'm thinking of is to add a LISTEN_ONLY mflag to mod_conference and only run conference_loop_input thread on channels that don't have this flag, that way I don't need to set up a shoutcast server and have everything contained within freeswitch, does that make sense?
On Thu, Apr 19, 2018 at 3:20 PM, Giovanni Maruzzelli <gmaruzz@gmail.com <mailto:gmaruzz@gmail.com>> wrote:
definitely conference with two participant, and 598 on localstream
-giovanni
On Thu, Apr 19, 2018, 18:38 Abaci B <abaci64@gmail.com <mailto:abaci64@gmail.com>> wrote:
Hi, I'm trying to set up a large audio conference of over 1000 users where only 1 or 2 users are talking and the rest are just listening, but after 600-700 users the CPU usage gets too high and the audio gets choppy, I understand that mod_conference is not optimized for my use case but was wondering if someone has any suggestions on what can be done to optimize for my use case. I was also thinking that maybe there is a better alternative for what I look for, such as having just the talkers on the conference and the listeners should listen to it via mod_local_stream or maybe use something like eavesdrop for the listeners but not sure if and how much performance I would gain. Thanks for any help or input
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Sincerely,
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You mean creating a new endpoint that would stream the conference, same idea as mod_lcoal_stream can stream a shoutcast stream? that's what I was thinking of but after looking at the code involved I see that is beyond my C skills, and I have a budget of only around $500 for this so don't think I will find someone else to do it. On Sat, Apr 21, 2018 at 4:43 AM, Giovanni Maruzzelli <gmaruzz@gmail.com> wrote:
is an audio conference.
what I would look into is something on these lines: have a conference with only the speakers. Put the listeners on music on hold, and use the conference output as music on hold stream. Give the listeners a bind meta key for being connected to the conference if they need to speak.
-giovanni
On 20 April 2018 at 21:45, Madovsky <infos@madovsky.org> wrote:
Latency is often caused by buffer and high quality video.
if you really need zero latency so find a way to set the buffer stream to zero and use
a very fast video encoding. On 4/20/2018 10:29 AM, Abaci B wrote:
I do understand that the way mod_conference work it is not efficient for my use case, my question is about the best alternative. Streaming would be ideal if it wouldn't be for the latency, since users need to be able to switch to talk mode there is no way a latency of 5-10 seconds (or possibly more) is acceptable. Another option is to use eavesdrop which I plan on testing next week to see if it scales, if someone has any input on it I would appreciate. The next option would be to optimize mod_conference for this use case, I started looking at the code and identified some places that performance can be optimized but may need to hire someone with better C skills to do the actual coding. another possibility may be, to use an RTP proxy that would just distribute the RTP to all callers, this would give the best performance but would limit features. Last option would be to develop a new module optimized for low latency streaming, but leave that as a last resort.
On Fri, Apr 20, 2018 at 1:15 PM, Tihomir Culjaga <tculjaga@gmail.com> wrote:
a conference with 1000 members demands huge resources... and this is not efficient if only 2-5% of members will actually talk. you need to keep the actual conference to the minimum number of "speakers" and move listeners to a streaming "service".
so, focus on how to get your entire conference streamed somewhere.
another thing to consider.... do the "listeners" really need to be in time sync with the conference ? They will just hear the conversation from the conference a bit later... thats all.
T.
On 20 April 2018 at 14:43, Abaci B <abaci64@gmail.com> wrote:
problem with shoutcast streaming is the extreme latency
On Fri, Apr 20, 2018 at 1:30 AM, Giovanni Maruzzelli <gmaruzz@gmail.com
wrote:
you definitely want to have only the speakers into conference, and stream to all others.
-giovanni
On 19 April 2018 at 23:37, Abaci B <abaci64@gmail.com> wrote:
I was thinking that the muted flag (CAN_SPEAK?) is something that can change mid conference which means there is a chance of loosing a single frame (the last one right before muting). I was more interested in knowing as far as performance if it makes sense. not sure if this is safe but something like only starting conference_loop_launch_input if that flag is not set. I still wish there would be module that would do exactly this (something like shoutcast but local and without the shoutcast latency)
On Thu, Apr 19, 2018 at 5:19 PM, Steven Ayre <steveayre@gmail.com> wrote:
> There's already a muted flag you could use for that. > > On 19 April 2018 at 20:55, Abaci B <abaci64@gmail.com> wrote: > >> Thanks for the reply. >> Another idea I'm thinking of is to add a LISTEN_ONLY mflag to >> mod_conference and only run conference_loop_input thread on channels that >> don't have this flag, that way I don't need to set up a shoutcast server >> and have everything contained within freeswitch, does that make sense? >> >> On Thu, Apr 19, 2018 at 3:20 PM, Giovanni Maruzzelli < >> gmaruzz@gmail.com> wrote: >> >>> definitely conference with two participant, and 598 on localstream >>> >>> -giovanni >>> >>> On Thu, Apr 19, 2018, 18:38 Abaci B <abaci64@gmail.com> wrote: >>> >>>> Hi, >>>> I'm trying to set up a large audio conference of over 1000 users >>>> where only 1 or 2 users are talking and the rest are just listening, but >>>> after 600-700 users the CPU usage gets too high and the audio gets choppy, >>>> I understand that mod_conference is not optimized for my use case but was >>>> wondering if someone has any suggestions on what can be done to optimize >>>> for my use case. >>>> I was also thinking that maybe there is a better alternative for >>>> what I look for, such as having just the talkers on the conference and the >>>> listeners should listen to it via mod_local_stream or maybe use something >>>> like eavesdrop for the listeners but not sure if and how much performance I >>>> would gain. >>>> Thanks for any help or input >>>> >>>> ____________________________________________________________ >>>> _____________ >>>> Professional FreeSWITCH Consulting Services: >>>> consulting@freeswitch.org >>>> http://www.freeswitchsolutions.com >>>> >>>> Official FreeSWITCH Sites >>>> http://www.freeswitch.org >>>> http://confluence.freeswitch.org >>>> http://www.cluecon.com >>>> >>>> FreeSWITCH-users mailing list >>>> FreeSWITCH-users@lists.freeswitch.org >>>> http://lists.freeswitch.org/mailman/listinfo/freeswitch-users >>>> UNSUBSCRIBE:http://lists.freeswitch.org/mailman/options/free >>>> switch-users >>>> http://www.freeswitch.org >>> >>> >>> ____________________________________________________________ >>> _____________ >>> Professional FreeSWITCH Consulting Services: >>> consulting@freeswitch.org >>> http://www.freeswitchsolutions.com >>> >>> Official FreeSWITCH Sites >>> http://www.freeswitch.org >>> http://confluence.freeswitch.org >>> http://www.cluecon.com >>> >>> FreeSWITCH-users mailing list >>> FreeSWITCH-users@lists.freeswitch.org >>> http://lists.freeswitch.org/mailman/listinfo/freeswitch-users >>> UNSUBSCRIBE:http://lists.freeswitch.org/mailman/options/free >>> switch-users >>> http://www.freeswitch.org >>> >> >> >> ____________________________________________________________ >> _____________ >> Professional FreeSWITCH Consulting Services: >> consulting@freeswitch.org >> http://www.freeswitchsolutions.com >> >> Official FreeSWITCH Sites >> http://www.freeswitch.org >> http://confluence.freeswitch.org >> http://www.cluecon.com >> >> FreeSWITCH-users mailing list >> FreeSWITCH-users@lists.freeswitch.org >> http://lists.freeswitch.org/mailman/listinfo/freeswitch-users >> UNSUBSCRIBE:http://lists.freeswitch.org/mailman/options/free >> switch-users >> http://www.freeswitch.org >> > > > ____________________________________________________________ > _____________ > Professional FreeSWITCH Consulting Services: > consulting@freeswitch.org > http://www.freeswitchsolutions.com > > Official FreeSWITCH Sites > http://www.freeswitch.org > http://confluence.freeswitch.org > http://www.cluecon.com > > FreeSWITCH-users mailing list > FreeSWITCH-users@lists.freeswitch.org > http://lists.freeswitch.org/mailman/listinfo/freeswitch-users > UNSUBSCRIBE:http://lists.freeswitch.org/mailman/options/free > switch-users > http://www.freeswitch.org >
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On 22 April 2018 at 23:38, Abaci B <abaci64@gmail.com> wrote:
You mean creating a new endpoint that would stream the conference, same idea as mod_lcoal_stream can stream a shoutcast stream? that's what I was thinking of but after looking at the code involved I see that is beyond my C skills, and I have a budget of only around $500 for this so don't think I will find someone else to do it.
I do not see $500 to fit the bill :) with a little bit of ingenuity, you can cobble together a solution: 1) have a conf with speakers only with a meta key that transfer them to extension abc if they don't need to speak anymore 2) have the conf outcall extension xyz 3) extension xyz answers and then shoutcast to shoutcast server 4) shoutcast server is used as source for music on hold 5) all listeners calls extension abc 6) extenmsion abc answers then put the caller on music on hold and give them a meta key that will transfer them to conf if they need to speak CPU=0 Profit! :D or, you can make a variation that uses mod_shell_stream that pipes the outcall to a temp mp3 file that is then streamed by music on hold to listeners. be creative! good luck, -giovanni -- Sincerely, Giovanni Maruzzelli OpenTelecom.IT cell: +39 347 266 56 18
I have a similar scenario, and my solution was to create several conferences. I have one master conference, that serves to connect all sub-conferences. So when a user calls in to the conference I add him to a sub conference, then I do an outdial to an extension that joins the sub conference to the master conference (this connection should not be muted). Once the sub conference has 250 participants, I create a new sub conference. I control all of this via ESL, this also requires some additional logic to handle conference commands, as I need to make sure it propogates to all sub conferences. The advantage of this approach is that instead of having one loop running on 1 CPU core looping through all listeners we now have multiple conference loops running on different cores. The issue with large conferences is that the conference loop runs every 20 ms by default and the main conference loop is not (and probably can't be) multi-threaded. Since on any large conference, there will most likely be only a handful of speakers, the best solution would probably be to optimize mod_conference to have a separate list of unmuted participants and only loop through those, but I was afraid to undertake such a change myself. On Thu, Apr 19, 2018 at 12:09 PM, Abaci B <abaci64@gmail.com> wrote:
Hi, I'm trying to set up a large audio conference of over 1000 users where only 1 or 2 users are talking and the rest are just listening, but after 600-700 users the CPU usage gets too high and the audio gets choppy, I understand that mod_conference is not optimized for my use case but was wondering if someone has any suggestions on what can be done to optimize for my use case. I was also thinking that maybe there is a better alternative for what I look for, such as having just the talkers on the conference and the listeners should listen to it via mod_local_stream or maybe use something like eavesdrop for the listeners but not sure if and how much performance I would gain. Thanks for any help or input
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Agree that mod_conference should probably be optimized to only loop unmuted members, but that only applies to the input thread the thread handling the output still needs to exist for everybody (except maybe for deaf members) but it would still be a savings since right now each conference member uses at least 3 threads if i understand correctly (1 for the channel, 1 for the input and another one for the output). the most optimal solution would probably be to either use shoutcast to stream for conferences where the latency isn't critical, and develop a streaming option for conferences, maybe something like conference_stream://conf_name that would be like local_stream and not like additional conference members with high overhead. I hope to 1 day either develop or sponsor development of such a feature, if there are others interested in the same functionality we maybe able to sponsor it together, I would offer $500 as a starter. On Mon, Apr 23, 2018 at 10:28 AM, Duvid Rottenberg <adrottenberg@gmail.com> wrote:
I have a similar scenario, and my solution was to create several conferences. I have one master conference, that serves to connect all sub-conferences. So when a user calls in to the conference I add him to a sub conference, then I do an outdial to an extension that joins the sub conference to the master conference (this connection should not be muted). Once the sub conference has 250 participants, I create a new sub conference. I control all of this via ESL, this also requires some additional logic to handle conference commands, as I need to make sure it propogates to all sub conferences.
The advantage of this approach is that instead of having one loop running on 1 CPU core looping through all listeners we now have multiple conference loops running on different cores. The issue with large conferences is that the conference loop runs every 20 ms by default and the main conference loop is not (and probably can't be) multi-threaded.
Since on any large conference, there will most likely be only a handful of speakers, the best solution would probably be to optimize mod_conference to have a separate list of unmuted participants and only loop through those, but I was afraid to undertake such a change myself.
On Thu, Apr 19, 2018 at 12:09 PM, Abaci B <abaci64@gmail.com> wrote:
Hi, I'm trying to set up a large audio conference of over 1000 users where only 1 or 2 users are talking and the rest are just listening, but after 600-700 users the CPU usage gets too high and the audio gets choppy, I understand that mod_conference is not optimized for my use case but was wondering if someone has any suggestions on what can be done to optimize for my use case. I was also thinking that maybe there is a better alternative for what I look for, such as having just the talkers on the conference and the listeners should listen to it via mod_local_stream or maybe use something like eavesdrop for the listeners but not sure if and how much performance I would gain. Thanks for any help or input
_________________________________________________________________________ Professional FreeSWITCH Consulting Services: consulting@freeswitch.org http://www.freeswitchsolutions.com
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I believe the main bottleneck of mod_conference is on the input thread. Regardless of which approach you take, you still need CPU capacity to push out the audio to all listeners. I don't think that mod_conference is any less efficient than any other module is at doing that. On Mon, Apr 23, 2018 at 10:46 AM, Abaci B <abaci64@gmail.com> wrote:
Agree that mod_conference should probably be optimized to only loop unmuted members, but that only applies to the input thread the thread handling the output still needs to exist for everybody (except maybe for deaf members) but it would still be a savings since right now each conference member uses at least 3 threads if i understand correctly (1 for the channel, 1 for the input and another one for the output). the most optimal solution would probably be to either use shoutcast to stream for conferences where the latency isn't critical, and develop a streaming option for conferences, maybe something like conference_stream://conf_name that would be like local_stream and not like additional conference members with high overhead. I hope to 1 day either develop or sponsor development of such a feature, if there are others interested in the same functionality we maybe able to sponsor it together, I would offer $500 as a starter.
On Mon, Apr 23, 2018 at 10:28 AM, Duvid Rottenberg <adrottenberg@gmail.com
wrote:
I have a similar scenario, and my solution was to create several conferences. I have one master conference, that serves to connect all sub-conferences. So when a user calls in to the conference I add him to a sub conference, then I do an outdial to an extension that joins the sub conference to the master conference (this connection should not be muted). Once the sub conference has 250 participants, I create a new sub conference. I control all of this via ESL, this also requires some additional logic to handle conference commands, as I need to make sure it propogates to all sub conferences.
The advantage of this approach is that instead of having one loop running on 1 CPU core looping through all listeners we now have multiple conference loops running on different cores. The issue with large conferences is that the conference loop runs every 20 ms by default and the main conference loop is not (and probably can't be) multi-threaded.
Since on any large conference, there will most likely be only a handful of speakers, the best solution would probably be to optimize mod_conference to have a separate list of unmuted participants and only loop through those, but I was afraid to undertake such a change myself.
On Thu, Apr 19, 2018 at 12:09 PM, Abaci B <abaci64@gmail.com> wrote:
Hi, I'm trying to set up a large audio conference of over 1000 users where only 1 or 2 users are talking and the rest are just listening, but after 600-700 users the CPU usage gets too high and the audio gets choppy, I understand that mod_conference is not optimized for my use case but was wondering if someone has any suggestions on what can be done to optimize for my use case. I was also thinking that maybe there is a better alternative for what I look for, such as having just the talkers on the conference and the listeners should listen to it via mod_local_stream or maybe use something like eavesdrop for the listeners but not sure if and how much performance I would gain. Thanks for any help or input
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Hello Duvid. Sorry for reply to you and not the list I have similar issue, but want to emulate 2 way radio through mod_conference, that means one people speak and broadcast to all listeners or target to only one listeners. The same but for listeners, when speak, is listen only for the main operator (agent). Can you share with us the core of your ESL script to handle your mod_conference behaviour? Thank you Regars Normando El 23/04/2018 a las 11:28 a.m., Duvid Rottenberg escribió:
I have a similar scenario, and my solution was to create several conferences. I have one master conference, that serves to connect all sub-conferences. So when a user calls in to the conference I add him to a sub conference, then I do an outdial to an extension that joins the sub conference to the master conference (this connection should not be muted). Once the sub conference has 250 participants, I create a new sub conference. I control all of this via ESL, this also requires some additional logic to handle conference commands, as I need to make sure it propogates to all sub conferences.
The advantage of this approach is that instead of having one loop running on 1 CPU core looping through all listeners we now have multiple conference loops running on different cores. The issue with large conferences is that the conference loop runs every 20 ms by default and the main conference loop is not (and probably can't be) multi-threaded.
Since on any large conference, there will most likely be only a handful of speakers, the best solution would probably be to optimize mod_conference to have a separate list of unmuted participants and only loop through those, but I was afraid to undertake such a change myself.
On Thu, Apr 19, 2018 at 12:09 PM, Abaci B <abaci64@gmail.com <mailto:abaci64@gmail.com>> wrote:
Hi, I'm trying to set up a large audio conference of over 1000 users where only 1 or 2 users are talking and the rest are just listening, but after 600-700 users the CPU usage gets too high and the audio gets choppy, I understand that mod_conference is not optimized for my use case but was wondering if someone has any suggestions on what can be done to optimize for my use case. I was also thinking that maybe there is a better alternative for what I look for, such as having just the talkers on the conference and the listeners should listen to it via mod_local_stream or maybe use something like eavesdrop for the listeners but not sure if and how much performance I would gain. Thanks for any help or input
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participants (8)
-
Abaci B
-
Duvid Rottenberg
-
Giovanni Maruzzelli
-
Madovsky
-
Normando Hall
-
Steven Ayre
-
Tihomir Culjaga
-
Tom Hartnett