Lawrence it still does not give an answer what do you do when the BYE does not arrive In this case only one end knows when the call ended The 30 sec disconnecting is very annoying to the users and it creates many problems with your customers When you disconnect the call it is much more problematic then a call that did not established, further more most of the HA systems are working well before the call is established, once it is established the HA no longer available As I said there is a lot of philosophy behind it, but I feel that they make a mistake in this point On Fri, Nov 16, 2012 at 3:23 PM, Lawrence Conroy <lconroy@insensate.co.uk>wrote:
Hi There, um ... the folk who thought up SIP used the Z-pattern for session initiation to ensure synchronisation between the parties. That's also the reason the path for the ACK is party-to-party direct, unlike the INVITE/200.
There's a real good reason for that -- it's a call, so both *ends* need to know what state they're in -- as everyone here has been telling you.
Trust me -- I was there, and the discussions were intense/painful. What you're proposing is exactly what was ditched back in 1997 -- RTP-based call completion. This is brittle -- it's being carried over UDP.
No-RTP call abort is useful (check out 3GPP's discussion on this and how IMS works -- in particular, the discussion on call handling when one end goes into a tunnel), but it is only a fallback, and is nasty when call & media go different routes.
Might I respectfully suggest that, if you think anyone is going to go over that again to produce a new RFC, you really should cut down on the crack.
Ignoring failure to receive ACK (after a whole series of attempts) is ignoring your call control channel being, to use the technical term, b*gg*r*d. Just say no.
all the best, Lawrence
On 16 Nov 2012, at 21:56, Yiftach Golan wrote:
This is where I am getting a bit confused, if the 200OK arrived to the other side and we checked that the RTP exists (with mod_sofia option) we will not get to hours of calls (unless the other side did not hanged up) In any case there is a good chance that the BYE is getting lost, so the danger exist even without the ACK
I am guessing that the designers of the SIP protocol came up with the ACK because there is a potential for open dialog that is not bound with time and they therefore wanted to know that the other side actually ACKs the request, but since ACK is tied to INVITE only (AFAIK) and INVITE always tied with RTP (at least in most normal SIP implementations) I'm not sure that this ACK is that needed but again as I said it is more of philosophical debate, maybe a potential request in the new RFC
On Fri, Nov 16, 2012 at 12:58 PM, Ken Rice <krice@freeswitch.org> wrote:
In this case masking the issue can lead to massive bills... Imaging paying by the minute... All of a sudden you are now leaving 2 minute calls up for hours on end... And continuing to get billed for them... Or you are not continuing to bill a customer for them... And now you have unexpected HUGE bills coming in... Masking it is far worse then just fixing it...
If we mask this one issue, we might as well mask memory leaks, or passwords that don’t work, etc... Sure sometimes we might have to mask an issue for production to work in the short term, but that is never the correct answer fix a problem
On 11/16/12 2:19 PM, "Yiftach Golan" <yiftah@choochee.com> wrote:
While I agree on the details I disagree on the solution Sometimes masking the problems can be a good solution but I guess it is a philosophical debate
On Fri, Nov 16, 2012 at 10:27 AM, Ken Rice <krice@freeswitch.org> wrote:
That leaves to big a risk of open sessions and only masks the true issue which is a problem with FS getting the ACK back...
Theres a reason FS is not getting the ACK, and FS will make several attempts to get an ack by retransmitting the 200 OK several times before that timeout occurs.
The real fix here is to fix the underlying cause, not masking it....
On 11/16/12 11:45 AM, "Yiftach Golan" <yiftah@choochee.com < http://yiftah@choochee.com> > wrote:
I know that it is kind out of the what RFC3261 instructs, but did anyone think on giving the option in configuration not to hang up calls in case of an ACK does not arrive? I know that it has the risk of open sessions but there some other ways to handle those cases
On Thu, Nov 15, 2012 at 6:35 PM, Ken Rice <krice@freeswitch.org < http://krice@freeswitch.org> > wrote:
This is probably the same scenario as this is exactly what to expect... Call gets answered far end doesn’t ACK FS sending them a 200OK , fs hangsup the call....
Quite common on networks with NAT issues or broken endpoints
On 11/15/12 7:43 PM, "Vitalie Colosov" <vetali100@gmail.com < http://vetali100@gmail.com> <http://vetali100@gmail.com> > wrote:
I saw this happened earlier when the remote party does not send SIP ACK after receiving SIP OK, so the call is being disconnected after exactly 32 seconds. Not sure if this is exact same scenario here, but just something to consider...
Regards. Vitalie
2012/11/15 kaleem rehman <k4kaleem@gmail.com <http://k4kaleem@gmail.com
Hi All,
my inbound calls are fine with no issues, my outbound calls get disconnected after 32 seconds and its on all calls. i tried 2 different suppliers and its same result. please find the attached log file with sofia in debug mode. - caller was extension 1234 and desination was 01908321682
your help will be greately appreciated.
regards, Kaleem
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