[Freeswitch-users] Request for change

Michael S Collins msc at freeswitch.org
Sat Aug 30 16:42:16 PDT 2008 

As I am the one primarily responsible for creating the Rosette Stone  
page I feel compelled to respond.

I agree with Anthony. The wiki does *not* presume that its readers  
have Asterisk experience. In fact, this is the very reason that the  
Rosetta Stone page was created.

That being said, there are scattered references to Asterisk. How can  
there not be? Asterisk is one of several reference points for FS. It  
is probably the key reference point. Most early adopters of FS have  
Asterisk experience - or in some cases, battle scars. :)

Brian West and I have been kicking around some ideas for a FS book.  
One key element in writing a book is knowing your target demographic.  
 From my two plus years in the FS community I can tell you that the  
demographic has started changing. Initially, the vast majority of FS  
users were Asterisk users. Today that isn't necessarily the case. We  
are noticing more people who say to us, "I saw FS and Asterisk on a  
Google search. I think FS looks right for me." In other words we're  
seeing first-time OSS telephony users and even first-time any kind of  
telephony users. These new ones needn't concern themselves with the  
Asterisk references except to put FS into historical context.

One last thing. You said, "...the beauty of asterisk is its  
simplicity." I can guarantee you that the Asterisk "refugees" here in  
the FS community will vehemently disagree with this statement.  
However, since beauty is in the eye of the beholder, we will let that  
comment slide. :)

We will take your comments as suggestions where we can improve things  
on the wiki. If you see any specific references to Asterisk that are    
spurious then let us know and we'll evaluate them on a case by case  
basis. You can also hop on IRC channel #freeswitch-docs and air your  
concerns in real time.

-MC

Sent from my iPhone

On Aug 30, 2008, at 9:59 AM, "Anthony Minessale" <anthony.minessale at gmail.com 
 > wrote:

> Hello,
>
> I think mostly everything you are saying is completely wrong.
>
> The majority of documents we have that mention asterisk strive to  
> make sure it's well understood that FreeSWITCH has an entire  
> different paradigm.  If you read your own statements you will see  
> you are not qualified to comment from the perspective of someone who  
> has never used either software because you said yourself that you  
> tried asterisk and found it easy to understand where following  
> FreeSWITCH was much more difficult.  That means you already fell  
> into the asterisk paradigm and now are struggling to shift to how  
> FreeSWITCH is designed.  The volunteers who work on the  
> documentation made a single section in the wiki for people who are  
> used to asterisk.  They can document whatever they want, they are  
> volunteers.
>
> You make two insulting comments about how I do not listen to the  
> users.  Please have a chat with the hundreds of users who have  
> influenced the design of FreeSWITCH and learn for yourself that this  
> is not true and in fact makes me incredibly angry that you would  
> have the nerve to even suggest it.
>
> You may also need a history lesson.  I myself did a great deal of  
> work on asterisk for several years.  It's part of my life and if I  
> want to talk about that experience or host my asterisk code on my  
> website then I will.  Of course you will not find anything about  
> FreeSWITCH on the asterisk website.  They are annoyed that we  
> exist.  You don't want there to be competition in open source then  
> go talk to them.  They are the only software to even use the word  
> compete that I have met so far.  We have ClueCon every year where we  
> work together with every open source project you can think of.  So  
> you may want to go do your homework more............
>
> You have insulted me and all of the volunteers who have spend  
> hundreds on the documentation by taking a quick scan of our site and  
> jumping to conclusions.  The time it took you to write this email  
> annoying me, you could have helped document something instead.  Now  
> I hope you do the right thing and apologize to them.  Don't bother  
> with me, it's them you owe the apology cos they are doing it all  
> just because they want to and for no other reason.
>
> I am sorry it takes you so long to understand FreeSWITCH but that is  
> not my problem.  This is my software for me to do whatever I want  
> with and you are someone who is choosing to use it so it's your  
> dilemma to learn how to work it or to decide if you prefer another  
> alternative but when you do so.  Do it with more respect and try to  
> imagine how much work it takes to provide you with something that  
> just works when you type "make"
>
>
>
>
> On Sat, Aug 30, 2008 at 5:38 AM, Sunil Singh  
> <sunil.d.admin at gmail.com> wrote:
> Hi,
>
> After going through the documents, I feel that the documents assume  
> that the guy who is going to use freeswitch is well versed with  
> asterisk or is an asterisk user who is going to switch to freeswitch  
> from asterisk. Its not from the point that somebody from scratch can  
> appreciate it for its design or any other thing.
>
> I appreciate the point of consideration for a large community, but  
> for freeswitch to be the best it has to wipe out that they know  
> asterisk. They should believe more on its users rather than what  
> asterisk is doing. Once a basic level is reached than it should be  
> user driven rather than asterisk driven. If we compete with them in  
> mind than eventually we will mess up.
>
> To be honest the beauty of asterisk lies in its simplicity. I was  
> reading freeswitch for hours and still struggling. Whereas in  
> asterisk I started and within hours I am up and running.
>
> I also realised that in asterisk I didn't find a document talking  
> about freeswitch but in freeswitch its only about, with asterisk in  
> mind. Whether they are documents or working.
>
> Comparisions will not allow to grow beyond a limit, we will always  
> be living in a psycho complex, leaving us with pain, agaony and anger.
>
> We should love what we are doing, and we want to make a universal  
> platform thats it. No point in comparision and running for a race.  
> Most of the open source are started by technology lovers that's it.  
> They don't create a technology to compete, they want to create a new  
> technology and that's why I started using freeswitch that its going  
> to create a new revolution which asterisk has lost because of  
> monetary considerations.
>
> So I request to please love what we are doing and when ever we are  
> making a document think that its for a novice.
>
>
> I request those who are driving it, please listen to your users  
> more. If you have started from scratch than let's some beauty come  
> out of it, a disruptive way of working. Like Apache, mysql ......   
> Ease of use is the main thing for a starter or anybody else. Even it  
> may be a best but if its not simple than people are not going to use  
> it and too much mention of asterisk in the doc will end up people  
> trying asterisk more rather than using freeswitch.
>
> The guys whom we are targetting today may not be there, there will  
> be a new generation and we should drive it with them in mind.
>
> I hope we all give it a thought and think from a novice point of view.
>
> Be a BOLT win with a self confidence and create only records.
>
> regards,
> Sunil
>
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>
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>
>
>
> -- 
> Anthony Minessale II
>
> FreeSWITCH http://www.freeswitch.org/
> ClueCon http://www.cluecon.com/
>
> AIM: anthm
> MSN:anthony_minessale at hotmail.com
> GTALK/JABBER/PAYPAL:anthony.minessale at gmail.com
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>
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